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MSNBC "All In with Chris Hayes" - Transcript: "Mueller to testify before Congress tomorrow."

Interview

Date: July 23, 2019

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HAYES: He was as super devoted Trump fan. Look, this is his Trump mobile complete with pro-Trump right-wing stickers plastered all over it. He said that attending a Trump rally was "like a newfound drug." His name is Caesar Sayoc, and as you may remember, this past year he was charged with sending explosive devices to 13 people including President Obama, Vice President Joe Biden, and Secretary of State Hillary Clinton. Caesar Sayoc, the MAGA Bomber pleaded guilty to mailing those devices. Today, his lawyers filed with sentencing memo laying out in stark terms his descent into violent extremism, calling him quote a Trump superfan who truly believed wild conspiracy theories he read on the Internet. He heard it for the present state, he saw it on Fox News which he watched at the start and end of his day. Sayoc`s lawyers explaining how the president and his propaganda network radicalized this guy. That comes as FBI Director Christopher Wray told senators at a hearing today that there have been about 100 domestic terrorism arrests just this year, majority of the suspects were motivated by some version of white supremacy. I`m joined now by 2020 presidential candidates Senator Amy Klobuchar of Minnesota who serves on the Judiciary Committee and questioned Christopher Wray earlier today. What did you learn from the FBI director specifically about that, about arrests for domestic terrorism and their relationship to right-wing political extremism or white supremacy?

SEN. AMY KLOBUCHAR (D-MN), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, he was pretty forthright about it and that he said there were increases. I`ve seen it in my own state, we`ve seen it across the country. We`ve seen bombing of mosques in Minnesota, we`ve seen of course horrible shootings at synagogues, and he -- I basically asked him, why do you think we`re seeing this increase? I have my own theories, of course, when you have someone in the White House who is constantly putting this of rhetoric out there, as you saw in this case, people who have issues come forward. When you have someone that says there are two sides to Charlottesville when the other side is the Ku Klux Klan, it gets people going. He said that it could have been reporting, increased reporting, they don`t know. I think the big question is what do we do about it? And my answer is that we need someone in the White House that isn`t constantly pushing the envelope and looking for divides and saying racist things and basically dividing our country. I think we need to bring people together.

HAYES: You had an exchange with the director about Russia and election interference today, a number of you did, including the chair of your committee, Lindsey Graham. What did you learn from him today?

KLOBUCHAR: Well, I was pushing on the fact that we need backup paper ballots, and we need some rules of the road for social media companies. And I was actually pleased by his answers. First of all, he said that we do need -- that paper ballots are helpful, because they give us extra protection, and then he also said that when it comes to social media, more information is better. And of course I`m talking here about paid political ads. And what I said today when a group of us got together with Senator Warner, here`s my problem, every step of the way, despite the FBI director`s warning about what`s happening in Russia and his testimony today that would be helpful to protect us to have backup paper ballots, every step of the way the White House has gut punched us. The former White House counsel was literally making calls to stop the bill for the backup paper ballots. He did that. He called Republicans. Mitch McConnell also wanted to stop the bill. We know that. It is a very clear fact.

HAYES: Wait, what is the articulated -- so you mean Don McGahn was lobbying for this behind the scenes?

KLOBUCHAR: Yes.

HAYES: So Don McGahn -- obviously Mitch McConnell hasn`t brought it up. You`ve got bipartisan cosponsors, right. The thing would pass, right?

KLOBUCHAR: I`ve got James Langford, not exactly a liberal, and I also have Lindsey Graham and we also had, of course, Burr, Richard Burr, the head of the intelligence committee.

HAYES: What is the -- is there a good faith stated rationale against the bill?

KLOBUCHAR: Oh, they argue that some states, secretary of states didn`t like it, some did, some didn`t. I`m telling you, it is very attenuated given that all we are saying is if you want the get federal money for elections, then you have to have got to have backup paper ballots. And we now still have 11 states. The Russians know which states they are, that do not have full paper ballots.

HAYES: You`re a former U.S. attorney, a former prosecutor. You serve on the Judiciary Committee now. I`m curious how you are looking at the testimony on the other side of Capitol Hill tomorrow from Robert Mueller.

KLOBUCHAR: Sure. What I would like to see first of all -- I have one focus is on the tax returns. Did Director Mueller review the tax returns? Because I had asked AG Barr. And know what he said, he was tired at the end. He said go ask Mueller, on the record.

HAYES: So you would like to see one of your colleagues ask him that question?

KLOBUCHAR: Oh, very much so. Alert, alert. And you have this -- it`s the same day, of course, where the president is suing to not have his tax returns revealed. So what`s in there? Second thing, those incidents of obstruction, which are very clear dangling pardons in front of Manafort and Cohen, how that connects with volume one and volume two, how that obstruction connects to the investigation. Did that obstruction stop Mueller in his investigation? Because I think it makes it very hard to get information if Manafort stops cooperating. And then the final thing, which we started out with here is just him methodically going through what Russia did. We need to put pressure on the Republicans to make sure that we get the Honest Ads Act done, which is my bill, which would simply say, hey, social media company, tell us where you`re getting the money for these ads and tell what`s they are, as well as the backup paper ballots.

HAYES: That final question -- I`m sorry, the middle question there about obstruction is really interesting to me. So you`re suggesting that you want to know if the obstruction undertaken by the president, as you see it, was actually successful in preventing Mueller from getting to all of the facts.

KLOBUCHAR: Exactly. And I think that that will be a very good line of questioning. I`m sure someone will ask it. But remember, Chris, you still haven`t seen those whole reports, right? There is volume one, which is about Russia. Volume two is more on obstruction. Volume two, which I was able to see the redacted versions of it, and that was enlightening. Well, guess what? I can`t even see volume one as ranking on the rules committee. They`re dividing us up. Intelligence gets to see the Russia part. We get to see the obstruction part on Judiciary. I`m sorry, these things aren`t divided. They are connected.

HAYES: All right. Senator Amy Klobuchar, thank you very much.

KLOBUCHAR: Thank you. It was great to be on.

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