CNN "State Of The Union With Jake Tapper" - Transcript "Interview with Mayor Pete Buttigieg"

Interview

BREAK IN TRANSCRIPT

Joining me now, Democratic presidential candidate South Bend Mayor Pete Buttigieg.

Mayor Buttigieg, thanks, as always, for joining us. We appreciate it.

BUTTIGIEG: Good to be with you.

TAPPER: So, I want to start on health care. You know that key moment between Vice President Castro -- I mean, Vice President Biden and Julian Castro on whether their plans would automatically enroll anyone.

You support Medicare for all who want it, but you have not released a full, detailed plan explaining it.

Would anyone be automatically enrolled under your proposal if they lost their insurance because they lost a job or for any other reason?

BUTTIGIEG: Yes.

And you will see more on that in our forthcoming plan. We need to make sure that we have a vision that gets everybody covered. The difference in my vision of Medicare for all who want it vs. the Sanders-Warren vision is, I think we can do that, and not order Americans onto that public alternative.

I actually think the public alternative that we create, that Medicare for all who want it, will probably be better than all of the private plans. I just trust the American people to make that decision for themselves and vote with their feet, rather than ordering them to switch plans when they don't want to.

TAPPER: When are you going to release the Medicare for all who want it plan?

BUTTIGIEG: Soon.

TAPPER: Soon. A week? A month?

BUTTIGIEG: I don't have a date for you, Jake.

TAPPER: OK.

What do you make of the criticisms of people like you or others who don't support embracing Medicare for all from people like Bernie Sanders or Elizabeth Warren, who say, you're ignoring the biggest problem here, which is, we spend all this money on health insurance, more than any other industrialized country, because the insurance industry is out for profits, not for making people better?

BUTTIGIEG: Well, that's just the point.

So if a private plan just can't be as cost-effective, because the profits are being sucked out of it, then the public plan is going to be better. If it's going to be better, and we give people that choice, people are going to choose it.

If they're that confident in the superiority of the public plan, why would they find it necessary to command Americans to adopt it, instead of just putting it out there? It's just a -- I guess a difference in the extent to which we trust people.

I do believe that we have got to look at more than just making that available too, though. So, the other big issue right now is affordability. And we have got to make sure we're addressing that, whether it's prescription drugs or the health care system overall.

And as you see our plans continue to unfold, you will see a lot on that too.

TAPPER: Let's turn to guns.

Your fellow candidate -- your fellow 2020 candidate Beto O'Rourke raised some eyebrows by saying -- quote -- "Hell, yes, we're going to take your AR-15, your AK-47" at the debate.

[09:05:03]

Democratic Senator Chris Coons of Delaware, who has endorsed Biden, he responded by saying -- quote -- "That clip will be played for years at Second Amendment rallies with organizations to try to scare people by saying, Democrats are coming for your guns."

Do you agree? Did Beto O'Rourke say something that's playing into the hands of Republicans?

BUTTIGIEG: Yes.

Look, right now, we have an amazing moment on our hands. We have agreement among the American people for not just universal background checks, but we have a majority in favor of red flag laws, high- capacity magazines, banning the new sale of assault weapons.

This is a golden moment to finally do something, because we have been arguing about this for as long as I have been alive. When even this president and even Mitch McConnell are at least pretending to be open to reforms, we know that we have a moment on our hands.

Let's make the most of it and get these things done.

TAPPER: I want to ask about Afghanistan, because, during the debate on Thursday night, you said -- quote -- "If there's one thing we have learned from Afghanistan, it's that the best way not to be caught up in endless war is to avoid starting one in the first place."

You said, that's the one -- if there's one thing to be learned from Afghanistan.

Do you think that the United States started the war in Afghanistan and not...

BUTTIGIEG: No, of course not. We went into the war in Afghanistan because we were attacked.

What I'm saying is that one lesson from just how endless that conflict has been is how hard it is to end a war, any war, in the 21st century. And we need to bear that in mind when you see things going on like what's happening with Iran right now that could lead to a new conflict breaking out.

September 15 is a very important date in my life, because that was the day that I left Afghanistan. That was five years ago. I thought I was one of the very last troops turning out the lights.

We're still there. And we're still arguing about how to get out.

TAPPER: Three of your opponents running for president now are expressing concerns about Joe Biden's sharpness and his ability.

Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JULIAN CASTRO (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Are you forgetting what you said two minutes ago?

(BOOING)

CASTRO: Are you forgetting already what you said just two minutes ago?

SEN. CORY BOOKER (D-NJ), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: There's a lot of people who are concerned about Joe Biden's ability to carry the ball all the way across the end line without fumbling.

There are definitely moments where you listen to Joe Biden and you just wonder.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Congressman Tim Ryan also told a reporter that Biden was -- quote -- "declining" and didn't have the energy to win.

We should point out that Booker and Castro have since tried to walk those comments back, suggesting they weren't talking about his sharpness, but do you share any of these concerns?

BUTTIGIEG: I think I trust voters to figure that out.

Look, as the youngest candidate in the field, I am obviously a believer in the power of generational change. I also believe that a candidate at any age, depending who they are, can be a great president.

What we have got to talk about right now is vision. My concern about the vision from the Sanders-Warren approach is that it can polarize Americans, when we have other ways to deliver bold solutions without dividing the American people further.

My difference with the vice president is that I also don't think promising that we're going back to normal is going a message that will hit people well, certainly where I come from in the Industrial Midwest.

There are a lot of people who voted for this current president, not because they think he's a good guy, but because normal wasn't working for them, and they were ready to more or less vote to burn the house down.

If all we have to offer is, hey, let's -- let's dial it back and go back to what we were doing, if it feels like we're looking to the past, I think that message is going to come up short when we get to Election Day.

TAPPER: A senior Obama-Biden administration official told me -- quote -- "Biden's strength has never been his clarity of message or his delivery. But watching his long, winding answers that don't really make sense in recent debates has also raised the question as to whether that has gotten worse and whether he is up for this."

This is your front-runner. I mean, this is the person that, as of right now, has the best chance, according to polls, of becoming the nominee. You really don't have any concerns you're willing to voice?

BUTTIGIEG: The front-runner in September before an election year is almost never the nominee.

This is a moment when people are evaluating their decisions. The field is finally winnowing. And we should be able to compete on our own message.

I should not have to poke personal holes in anybody else in order for my message to get through and to be convincing, if I want to win and if I deserve to win.

TAPPER: Well, let's talk about the substance of one of the things that Vice President Biden said at the debate.

When asked about the legacy of slavery, he seemed to suggest using a record player at home for minority families to teach them how to be better parents could be part of the equation.

Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOSEPH BIDEN (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We bring social workers in to homes and parents to help them deal with how to raise their children.

It's not want they don't want to help. They don't -- they don't know quite what to do. Play the radio, make sure the television -- excuse me -- make sure you have the record player on at night, the -- the -- make sure that kids hear words.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: I saw a lot of people, a lot of progressives, a lot of prominent African-American commentators talking about the substance of that answer...

BUTTIGIEG: Yes.

TAPPER: ... and being horrified, if not -- as well as offended.

[09:10:01]

What was your response to it?

BUTTIGIEG: It was a well-intentioned answer, and it was a bad answer.

The reason that we are seeing racial inequity in this country is that it was put into place on purpose. And I'm not just talking about slavery beginning 400 years ago.

I'm talking about policy decisions that happened within living memory that excluded black Americans from everything from fully being able to access the G.I. Bill to labor protections. These have consequences. The V.P. is interested in -- I think he was trying to get at the issue of how many words infants hear as children. Interesting issue.

There is a much bigger picture here. And it has to do with inheritance. It has to do with the wealth gap and the fact that, if you are black in this country, as a consequence of systemic racism, you start out with less.

In the same way that, if you save a dollar, it compounds over the years and becomes more and more, the same is true of a dollar stolen. And that has happened to black Americans through generations.

It's why I have proposed the Douglass Plan, as ambitious as the Marshall Plan that rebuilt Europe. But, this time, we have got to invest right here in America.

Criminal justice reform is important, but that's not all there is to the black experience in this country. We have got to be lifting up black entrepreneurs, making sure that federal taxpayer spending -- and I propose we do this at a 25 percent target -- is going to businesses owned by those who have been systematically disadvantaged in the past, investing in HBCUs that are training what could be the new class of black millionaires and a black middle class of professionals in education, law enforcement, medicine.

We need systemic answers to deal with this issue. And we need to confront the legacy of discrimination.

TAPPER: All right, Mayor Pete Buttigieg, thank you so much for your time today. Appreciate it.

Good luck on the campaign trail.

BUTTIGIEG: Thanks.

BREAK IN TRANSCRIPT

Source