CNN Crossfire - Transcript

CNN

SHOW: CNN CROSSFIRE 16:30

HEADLINE: Pain at the Pump

GUESTS: Diana DeGette, Darrell Issa

BYLINE: Robert Novak, Paul Begala

HIGHLIGHT:
Which presidential candidate has the best plan to ease the pain at the gas pump?

BODY:
NOVAK: Congresswoman DeGette, I want to have a little reality dose.

REP. DIANA DEGETTE (D), COLORADO: I think that would be a good idea.

NOVAK: With all the stuff I've been hearing.

(LAUGHTER)

NOVAK: Today, the gas, the price of gas-we're going to put it up on the screen-is $2. In 1981, just as Jimmy Carter was leaving office, we'll take a look at that, the price, adjusted for inflation, was $2.90. Now, can you tell me any other commodity, any commodity, housing, anything you could think of, cars, that is cheaper, adjusted for inflation, today than it was 21, 24 years ago?

DEGETTE: There might be some. I can't think of them off the top of my head. But let me talk about what my colleague

(CROSSTALK)

NOVAK: No, I want you to answer my question.

DEGETTE: I can't think of one off the top of my head.

NOVAK: So it's a phony thing, then.

(APPLAUSE)

DEGETTE: But let me tell you something. Let me tell you something.

Gas just a few months ago was well under $2 a gallon and this energy bill does nothing to solve it. I don't know if my colleague was in the same hearings, but I thought

(CROSSTALK)

DEGETTE: Just listen.

ISSA: How does an energy solve it when it's been held up? Let us pass it.

DEGETTE: Just listen.

NOVAK: Let her talk.

DEGETTE: All of the amendments we did in the committee for renewable energy, for conservation, all were defeated if the big oil companies didn't like them. And this energy policy was written behind closed doors in the White House without any of the meaningful things in it that would have saved money.

(APPLAUSE)

ISSA: I don't know about the legislation you worked on, but my legislation which I got to help craft in fact came out of the House, came out of our committees and clearly includes a lot of things that completely bubbled up from California.

NOVAK: I don't want to regurgitate that whole energy bill.

(CROSSTALK)

NOVAK: I just want to continue my reality dose.

You know, people, Diana, are really laughing at Americans when they are crying about $2 gasoline. Let's take a look at this. Prices in U.S. dollars today a gallon, United Kingdom, $5, Netherlands, $5, France, nearly $5, Germany $4.5, Japan, $4.25. We're $2. This is a bargain. This is the cheapest gasoline anywhere in the industrialized world.

DEGETTE: You're right.

(APPLAUSE)

DEGETTE: I can't argue with that.

But you know what? My constituents don't think about that when they call my office to complain that their gas prices are over $2 a gallon. They're not complaining.

NOVAK: They're spoiled.

DEGETTE: They're not complaining to Congressman Issa. His gas prices are about $2.35 a gallon.

Now, maybe they are spoiled, but I think our energy policy needs to have a reality dose. And the reality dose we need to have, we need to have more renewables. We need to have more conservation. Gas could be even cheaper in this country.

(APPLAUSE)

BEGALA: But let me read you a very specific pledge that then my governor, George W. Bush of Texas, made when he was running to become president on this very topic of Arab gouging, the cartel, which controls the price of oil. Here's what George W. Bush said in the debate.

(CROSSTALK)

BEGALA: Here's what the president said-the governor then said in the debate: "What I think the president ought to do is, he ought to get on the phone with the OPEC cartel and say, 'We expect you to open your spigots! OPEC has gotten its supply act together and its driving the price, like it did in the past. And the president must jawbone OPEC members to lower the price."

That's what he said he would do if he were president. He is president now. His press secretary, Scott McClellan, was asked this question. "He, the president, is not calls to OPEC individuals himself, is he?" White House Press Secretary Scott McClellan says no.

Why didn't the president keep his word?

ISSA: The fact is, the president made a real effort to get the spigot turned on and to keep it turned on. During the Nigerian oil problem, they increased production. During the Venezuelan shutdown, they increased production. Today OPEC, for better or worse, which includes Venezuela-it's not just Arabs-in fact produces more oil than it did during Jimmy Carter or Bush I or Clinton.

Our reliance on them has driven up their total volume again and again and again. We have a couple of problems. And one of the biggest is, we haven't built a refinery in this country in 30 years. We're at 96-plus percent refining capacity right now. The truth is, the difference between oil prices and gas prices includes a shortage of refining capacity.

We have a lot of problems in this country. And not dealing with the energy bill, having it blocked by my colleague here is part of the problem.

(CROSSTALK)

(APPLAUSE)

BEGALA: Surely our president, coming out of the energy industry, actually, I think he has got a complex understanding of all of those nuances. He didn't say any of those things, Congressman. He made a promise to every person in this audience, everyone listening to us, he said, if you make me president, I'll get on the phone and jawbone the OPEC nations. His press secretary says he hasn't kept that promise. I'm asking you, shouldn't the president keep his word?

(APPLAUSE)

ISSA: His press secretary has said in answer to one time, one question.

I will tell you, I've traveled in the Arab world probably 15 times since I've been a member of Congress, and most recently 30-some days ago. The fact is, they are producing and they're keeping volumes reasonably high. OPEC prices have a lot to do with uncertainty. It has to do with an awful lot of problems. Now, am I going to take the effort off of that? No.

We are in fact a world that is producing more oil and consuming it. And if you want to look at one of the core problems, it's the fact that China is doubling every three years its oil consumption.

DEGETTE: So I guess, then, the congressman thinks that it's just fine if gas prices continue to go up and the president never does intend to call OPEC. And that's part of the problem with this administration.

(CROSSTALK)

NOVAK: Congresswoman, you talk about renewable fuel. Now, your candidate, Senator Kerry, has a whole-he's a very rich guy and he has this whole fleet of gas burners. He has an SUV that goes about 12 miles to the gallon.

BEGALA: It's a family car.

NOVAK: It's his car.

(CROSSTALK)

NOVAK: The question is, is he setting a good example for America? What kind of impact does it have when you talk about renewable fuels and he's burning gas in an old gas guzzler?

(APPLAUSE)

DEGETTE: I don't think the American public-I don't think the American public care about what the Kerry family drives, so much as they care about what energy policy is driving this country.

And just right now, not only is the president failing to call OPEC, like he said he is, but also, despite this sharp increase in gas prices that we're seeing, with no end in sight, by the way, what you're seeing is the administration is adding 170 barrels a day to the Strategic Reserve.

ISSA: You better believe it.

DEGETTE: And Senator Kerry and I, we don't believe that we should be drawing down on the Strategic Reserve, as some senators have suggested.

(CROSSTALK)

DEGETTE: But what we do think is that right now in this time, we could be using that to stabilize gas prices while we negotiate with OPEC. Neither-the administration just seems to have a laissez- faire attitude, whatever happens happens.

(APPLAUSE)

(CROSSTALK)

NOVAK: We'll out of time. We have to take a break.