FOX "Interview With Senator Bernie Sanders" - TRanscript

Interview

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MS. COLBY: Have you checked your mail lately? I know you're not opening your 401(k) statements, but how about your credit card statements?

Well, guess what. The credit card companies are sending out notifications. Check it out, because they're jacking up interest rates that you're paying as high as 20 and 30 percent. That's after you loaned them money as part of the massive government bailout. That's one way of saying thanks.

So should the government cap credit card rates to give you a break? Our next guest thinks so, and he's doing something about it. Senator Bernie Sanders, an independent, from Vermont. Senator, great to have you with us.

SEN. SANDERS: Good to be with you, Jamie.

MS. COLBY: I -- first of all, I know you look at the credit unions, and you say: Hey, they've done pretty well. They don't need bailout money, and they capped interest rates years ago.

Tell us how they fared.

SEN. SANDERS: Well, the credit unions are doing great. They're not coming to Congress for hundreds of billions of dollars in bailouts. In fact, they're responding to the needs of their small business people and their constituents very, very well. And for 30 years they have been regulated, so that in general they can't charge more than 15 percent, unless -- there are some exceptions up to 18 percent. But most credit unions today are providing credit cards for less than 15 percent.

And it seems to me, as you've just indicated, that when the taxpayers of this country are spending hundreds of billions of dollars bailing out Wall Street as a result of their greed and their recklessness, the thank you that we're getting is, people are paying 20, 25, 30 percent interest rates on their credit cards. About one- third of the American people now are paying more than 20 percent. That is an outrage.

In addition to that --

MS. COLBY: And due to the state of the economy, Senator --

SEN. SANDERS: I'm sorry --

MS. COLBY: -- let's face it -- a lot of people are using their credit cards for things that they never would have thought of -- to pay college costs, to pay housing expenses, just to live on.

SEN. SANDERS: That's a --

MS. COLBY: But are you concerned at all, Senator -- and I really am curious what you think -- that you will encourage people, if you lower the rates, to use credit cards more than they did in the past, by lowering the interest rate, and that we'll be in a whole new mess?

SEN. SANDERS: No. The reality, as you indicated -- because of the collapse of the middle class and the financial crisis, you go to the grocery store, you're seeing people buying milk and bread with credit cards. You're seeing students paying off part of their college expenses with credit cards. Those people should not be forced to pay 25 or 30 percent interest rates.

You know, the function of Wall Street is not to get engaged in usury rates, and they have got to be regulated. The middle class deserves a break.

MS. COLBY: In fact, in law school, I remember, usury was against the law. We were talking at that time about 25 percent. So how have we gotten to 20 to 30 percent? And how much support do you have for this? Because Senator Alfonse D'Amato got this actually passed by the Senate years ago. What happened?

SEN. SANDERS: Senator Alfonso (sic) D'Amato got it passed with a huge vote in the Senate. I think there is support all over America.

The problem obviously that we're going to have is our friends on Wall Street and the financial institutions have contributed hundreds of millions of dollars over the years in campaign contributions and lobbying. They are very powerful. They're going to oppose this very, very aggressively.

On the other hand, I think the American people are tired of getting ripped off.

MS. COLBY: And I also want to ask you, if we lent this money to the banks, in the billions, is it not in our interest to try to get the banks to earn it back as quick as they can, because we'd like to have our money back? So isn't it in the interest of the American public who isn't relying on credit cards, isn't abusing their credit cards, to get their money back quicker and these interest rates, in a sense, do have an income stream into the banks that will be helpful?

SEN. SANDERS: Oh, I don't think so. I mean, I think it is -- I know you're trying, but it is very hard to defend --

MS. COLBY: Well, at 15 percent, do they lose money?

SEN. SANDERS: No. (Chuckles.) They're not going to lose money. These -- you know what they're borrowing money at from the Fed right now? At zero interest rates! How are you losing money when you're charging 15 percent?

You know, what used to exist in this country is, we had state law regulating interest rates. All over the country states were saying 12, 14 percent.

As a result of a Supreme Court decision about 25 years ago, that was negated. So the credit card companies could go to states like South Dakota and -- where there were no interest rate caps, and charge anything that they wanted to.

The bottom line is, the banks have been getting away wit murder. For many years they've been making huge product -- huge profits, not only in terms of high interest rates but excessive fees as well. And I think the American people want re-regulation in that area. They want us to stand up to these banks and give the middle class a break.

MS. COLBY: All right. Senator, keep us posted on how it goes on that one.

SEN. SANDERS: We sure will. Thank you for your interest.

MS. COLBY: South Dakota -- I know a lot of these companies -- that's exactly where they are.

Thank you. Good to see you.

SEN. SANDERS: Thank you.

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